I was waiting in the doctor's surgery the other day - generally the only time I read women's magazines (often old ones at that) when I found an interesting article. It was about Tassie Rural Women's Awards for 2007 and one of the winners was Rachael Treasure, author and dog trainer. Out of interest I looked up Rachael Treasure on the internet and found that a year later she had used the award bursary to write an online book on training working dogs based on what she calls natural dogmanship - a method centred on love and praise. The book itself is $12.95 and is called "Wise Women and Hot Dogs". I like the fact that she also has a woman's viewpoint on dog and stock handling.

Sounds really interesting. I have read her 3 novels and just love them. She has Kelpies and writes about them in her stories. I will definately have to get the training books. Thanks for that Flyingdog.

Flying dog, do you know if her methods are based on similar principles to natural horsemanship? I find it interesting that NHM training is often described as being based on love and reward, when, though it may be gentle and humane, it's nearly all negative reinforcement and the praise/reward that happens is not what is driving the learning.

I find it really frustrating when particular trainers claim some special access to knowledge of training methods/dog psychology - when the science is universal and close to invariable. (ok -I'm off my soapbox now ;-)

I too have read all her novels, can't wait for her next one!

Rachael uses the same training techniques as Paul McPhail, as he was the one who taught her.. I personally dont like Paul's training technique. I saw him working his dogs back a few months ago, he didn't seem to have much control over them. I was actually a little disapointed. But that's only my opinion and my views may be different to others
Has anyone read Tully Williams book 'working sheepdogs'. Now that is a good read. A few of his techniques are similar to the natural horsemanship. I am training our dogs using his method. I really like his views regarding what makes a good worker etc.

thanks for this info, would love to get hold of her novels, i assume they are still available.

They are still available Jcas, your local bookshop should most definately have em. :)

Thanks Peejy, just noticed a few on ebay, might go and do some bidding ...

Are they sequels to each other, if so which one should be read first, or are they seperate stories??

I am anxiously awaiting the books, i was lucky enough to get all 3 novels, as new for 35.00 delivered from oztion, so i am really pleased ...

Cool! I'm sure you'll enjoy them.. They are not sequels, so it doesn't matter what order you read em in. She wrote Jillaroo first, then The Stockmen and lastly The Rouseabout. My fav is the Stockmen..
Her next novel 'the Cattlemen' (i think that's the title) should be a great read too when it comes out. :)

Peejy I have just finished the Tully Williams Working dogs book, requested it from the State Library in QLD. I do like his advice about picking a dog out of the litter, was very similar to what Eric Tighe said at the herding workshop at Durong.

Rachael Treasures books are very popular in the library but I have not read any of hers as of yet. I have about 30 books to get through. I have three on the go at the moment. Which reminds me I am off to start one, ciao.

Would anyone be able to tell me a bit more about Rachael Treasure's fiction books? Just wondering if my mum would like them - looking at Christmas pressies in advance!!! Are they easy to find??

Bluedog, I have the links to info on each of her novels from her website, there is heaps of info there so you should be able to decide whether your mum will like them ;)

Jillaroo (http://rachaeltreasure.com/?p=41)
The Stockmen(http://rachaeltreasure.com/?p=134)
The Rouseabout (http://rachaeltreasure.com/?p=137)

Bluedog i haven't got mine yet but i have been reading the reviews on them , and not one bad review, in fact everybody that reviewed them read them in record time as the reckoned they couldn't put them down,if your Mum likes animals and the farm land i reckon she would like them.

Good questions KoolieMum. Here are some of my ramblings and I would like to hear more of other's experiences.

I finished the ebook "Wise Women and Hot Dogs" - it was the first of her books that I have read and I do like Rachael's fluid style of writing and will try to get some of her other books. It certainly is not a dry training manual - there are aspects which I thought very useful. I think what she is doing is great and I can learn from her but it is a matter of adapting information to my own situation. I am familiar with natural horsemanship as I am studying Parelli with my horse. I started a few years ago because I lacked confidence and it has helped me heaps. I found that horses seek comfort and thats why I find it easy to work with my big sook of a horse. What Parelli has taught me is how horses communicate with each other but I am also aware of his personality which is very introverted and shy and he doesn't take pressure. He has come a long way with these methods and I am pleased that I was able to go to the Parelli conference in Sydney so that I could see it in action. From that I was able to see that even natural horsemanship needs careful interpretation rather than just simply using negative reinforcement as a tool to train a horse. I think its important to be willing to do what it takes to get close to the horse, understand its personality, react accordingly and create a real bond.

Getting back to the book under discussion I think that Rachael is perhaps using a form of dog communication which means that she is understood to be the 'Alpha' dog. I can indentify with her experience as my first kelpie has taught me a lot about myself because she is so strong willed. She taught me years ago when we were regularly working sheep together that I was a bit of a pushover and I need to deserve the title of alpha dog in her eyes! I now know that its a subtle thing - to do with confidence, body language and experience. In recent years I have tried to read as much as possible to learn more and put new ideas into practice. I havn't read Tully Williams (thanks Peejy)- will look into getting the book. I know dogs have different personalities and so what works for one doesn't work for another. So far my experience is that the koolies seem to respond differently to the kelpies which makes their training very interesting.

You cannot go wrong with Rachael Treasure fiction, even though I have not read any of hers she is a good Australian writer and I recommend them to people that like Australiana. Other authors that are similar is Di Morrissey and Tamara McKinlay, both write about Australia.

Flying Dog, I agree I tend to read a lot about dog training and also psychology of dogs. A good overall one is Dog Training for Dummies. Just pick out the parts that you can work with. And I agree Koolies are a different ball game when it comes to training, you cannot use force (well with Ceejay you can't) and I tend to not like forcing my animals so she suits me down to the ground. But by geez she can be stubborn if she wants to be. Just started agility training and Izzy my Kelpie x just wants to please me, Ceejay also wants to please me but she tests me out now and again with her independent streak.

Ceejay - you have summed up my experience with the kelpie and koolies exactly. I have just started agility training with the koolies and my kelpie is an old hand - she just wants to please and love treats. The koolies have to be taught very slowly with no pressure and then they can get bored and decide that they really would prefer to do something else. The reason I started using agility is to keep it interesting for them and despite some attitude problem at times, they are actually learning and their general obedience has improved. They seem to be like children who look like they are not listening and then later surprise you because they have been paying attention all along.

Koolie’s are very clever children, who seem to pick your brains and read your thoughts.
With training I abandoned traditional, didn't even consider food and discovered play and the Koolie has an enormous play drive.
Work is not work it's just a good time and if everyone's pleased, it's a win, win situation and the Koolie excels.
If your Koolie becomes ”stubborn” then stretch yourself and learn why, bored? reserved, shy, reluctant, different word saying the something, I just haven’t quite got there yet, the handler not the dog.
The Koolie has rewritten all books, on breeds, their habits, character, learning, training, growing, it is a wonderful journey of discovery and you need to throw away preconceived approaches or at the very least remain adaptable and opened to learning from them.
Just my opinion, but “Follow the Force Luke” pops into mind. :-)

I agree TJ, Ceejay wasn't keen on the weave until I cottoned on to the fact that she didn't like the word out, so changed it to the word to. If one way doesn't work I try another, thank goodness the trainers are not inflexible. She gets ever so excited at the end of a round that I get plenty of kisses from her. And I love the fact that Ceejay has a bit of that stubbon button in her as it makes me work out different methods to make it successful.

To tell you the truth Ceejay and I have a lot in common when it comes to personality. lol.

One thing I try to remember when training a dog is to remember to make as clear as possible what is wanted behaviour and what is not wanted and making it easy for the dog to succeed every time! That's what makes you think!! We know what we want in our head and to get that through to the dog - sometimes we need to break it right down into small steps!

I'm lucky with Paxy she is both food and play driven so I can swap between the two if I need to! I just hope I can do a job for her!

Flyingdog - when did you do the Parelli course? I thought of doing a course with him years ago but as I didn't have a horse well it was really going to be for nothing, just my interest. There was another fellow in the Hunter Valley who was teaching this method but I haven't seen him advertise much in the last couple of years.

That's one of the first things Alexis told me, set them up for success, & it works every time. The problem I had with Izzi is she isn't interested in play & only silghtly in food, she's sensitive & gets bored at the drop of a hat, so I do 5mins work then send her over some jumps, through a tyre & around the poles then 5min work & finish, sounds all over the place but seems to be working.
I did a few clinics with Wayne Baney & really enjoyed them, he's a very down to earth Aussie & isn't every one's cup of tea but I like that he's straight forward. I took my stallion & learned heaps ended up doing canter piroette & flying changes in a halter, not in the first clinic of course.

I have thought at various times that both my dogs and my horse were stubborn, difficult etc. Now I hang my head with shame that I ever thought it. They have always learnt what they were taught.

Kooliemum I agree with that sentiment. As Ceejay has learnt from me. I am described as determined, pig headed and stubborn at times and I know that Ceejay must pick this up from me. I have to make myself THINK of alternative ways to train her and make it interesting for her. It can be my best trait or my worst depending on which end of the spectrum I am at or the other person is at. When it does get to that stage with the training we both take a breather and romp on the grass then we get back into it and it usually clicks with both of us.

Good to read the various approaches to koolie training/motivation.

Bluedog, re: Parelli. I bought the level 1 and 2 home study packs from the Parelli website and the gear for level 1 came with them. The teaching methods in the packs are excellent and easy to follow and you can do them at your own pace. After a year I took my horse to a weekend course in Young with a Parelli teacher. I am now half way through level two which takes a lot longer than the level one course. The Parelli website lists trainers and their courses.