Now I may be re hashing some very salient points here but given that we have an older (senior) dog and a young pup. I need to glean some further knowledge in regards to food stuffs.

I like to ensure the older dog has glucosamine or similar to aid joint protection, I start this as an additive or supplement at about 5 or 6 years depending on their activity levels ( usaully very high) I also decrease some food intake dependant on their activity if they look to be gaining weight as they get older...too much weight means more stress on old joints means more wear and tear on them. So my older dog has meat each night or processed dog food (Ecopet or VIP) in lieu of this she might have left overs ( pasta, roast with vegies, shepherd pie, fish ( minus bones) she also has dry food ( Pal senior but I am trying Purina One right now on a double cash back deal for doing a survey) Mornings they both have left over Weetbix and Meaty muesli ( which is very good). The pup is on Puppy Pal (dry), rice, chicken, veggies (left overs) and Puppy meat (VIP?) at night. They have raw bones fortnightly( lamb shank or beef shin).

I have heard of a dry food called Eagle Pack? ANy one else heard of it?If so, what was/is your opinion of it?
Also does any one "wet down" their dry food...a friend told me she does this and I had never heard of it, she says its good for when pups are getting adult teeth?

I know several people who feed (I think they still do) Eagle Pack. They seemed to be real happy with it.

We usually feed dry food, but when we are introducing a litter of puppies to solid food, we soak it in broth (beef, chicken).

Sometimes during the winter when we are using our dogs real hard we will stir in alot of broth and make it like soup. That way they stay well hydrated. We do that also for our old dogs in extreme weather.

The best supplement for any dog that is needing a nutritional boost is a product called Nutri Cal. I also use it often for dogs I'm working real hard.

Thanks Jeanne Joy I had never heard for soaking or "wetting down" dry food before, but the more i look into it; the more it make sense...as you said with broth, it would make a tasty meal. After all most dry dog food is only dehydrated meat..soaking it is only reconstituting it to is original form. I am up in the air about Eagle Pack still, a lot of breeders of large dogs use it as a 15k bag lasts over a month with a big dog so I am wondering if its popularity is cost related and not nutrition related.

Maybe the Eagle Pack in Australia is not the same as what is here in America. It has been at least 10 years since I talked to anybody about it, so it may have changed. I'd check it out with breeders over there before I used it. I guess you could try a bag or so to see how you liked it.

Keep in mind it takes about a month before you really see the results of a new diet. When switching over to new food, do it over a period of several days.

The first day give 3/4 of the old diet, 1/4 of the new food.
The second day give 1/2 and 1/2.
The third day give 1/4 of the old diet, 3/4 of the new.
On the fourth day you can give 100 percent of the new diet.

The gradual introduction is ideal because it takes 3 days for the intestinal flora to adapt to change.

Thanks, I knew about gradual intro when swapping food or adding new ones, bit like baby education diet. Did some more looking and asking, apparently Eagle Pack is favoured by some here for the following reasons:
It (supposedly ) has a better quality meat product than Aust made ones...I was told that ones made here are made up of offal and abbatoir refuse( same as canned produce)
It is better value for money with regards to other OS made foods.

I don't know about the info but this is the reply I got when I asked a few who use/have used it. Some just swap about as they win 15-20k bags at shows and just use that (IAMS/Eukabana) so it could just be a cost effective thing, because I would not be switch hitting my dry dog food like that.

Might get some and see, Pet Deli has it and delivers, but I don't want to muck about with the pups diet. So might try the Senior one with Jemma and see how she fares with it.

Firstly...we have farm dogs, bulk numbers, bulk food. They also have a tendancy to cruise for the delacasies during Spring such as, calf poo, anything dead, bunnies and generally anything smelly and ripe.

Koolies are a working dog, they have simple desires and needs. I think most people working koolies would agree a good basic diet of dry food such as Meaty Bites or Bonnie working dog is a good basis. Add the delacasies and when they are not available some good bones, maybe the odd egg and for us some cows milk or colostrum and you have a pretty good diet (even the odd bit of tin food). KISS works well when feeding a koolie. I wonder sometimes that some of the plethora of "problems" people have with the modern family dog such as alergies are not stemming from the top shelf feed and the weird things they feed them. Someone sent their "menu" once to see if it was sufficient, it included a banana smoothie twice a week and some unbeleivable stuff, I wanted to know when I could move into the dog kennel...

We like to pre soak dry feed for puppies, we have the luxury of cows milk available which we often use, but also soaking in warm water on cold days is good for old dogs (they also take up the moisture quicker). We often drop an egg on top of that.

Lawson doesn't look like he is too hard done by

Silhouette, you hit the nail on the head. I have read plenty of researach to indicate that the preservatives (chemicals)like ethoxiquin in dog food are major contributors for disease.

Eggs are great. They are a complete protein and the dogs love them. I started boiling the eggs after I learned that raw egg whites tie up the biotin in their system; but my husband always gave one of our old dogs a fresh egg every morning just after we collected them (despite my caution). Never-the-less Chester always had the glossiest coat.

I know a lot of breeders who use puppy milk replacement to wet dry food for their puppies also. Cottage cheese is also an excellent supplement.

I was surprised by one of the diets I saw a man feeding in Europe. It was dry flakes with freeze dried peas and carrots.

When I was a little girl there wasn't much to choose from in the way of commercial dog food. Like Silhouette, we had dairy cows. Actually we had a diverse operation. We ran beef cattle, had dairy cows and ran a flock of sheep. The dogs were fed all sorts of things from table scraps to what ever they came up with on their own. Things I wouldn't dream of giving them today.

When my father was a boy you couldn't even buy dog food, but then the majority of America (greater than 75%) lived on properties that kept chickens and at least one cow for milk. How times have changed.

Hey Lawson Tjukurpa has always added water to the dry feed, learned it from my dad and him from his.
We mainly do it as pups are being weaned, we use and have always used Bonnie, they take the pup right through adult to seniors, so you’re not changing brands.
They do not add preservatives or additives, it is just dehydrated roo meat.
The puppy pallets we offer to our weaning pups between three and four weeks.
We soak them overnight in a water and Vitrate mixture, very good for strong immune systems, we only introduce the Vitrate once a week and the occasional egg.
It must taste good because they eat every drop, no need to show them how or where it is.
We feed them this three times a day, plus chicken wings for lunch, puppies can't really eat the chicken wings but they are great for those new and annoying teeth coming through and saves my furniture and shoes.
Then mum comes back in of a night time, by five weeks their fully weaned and independent of mum and we begin to leave the Bonnie puppy pallets down in dry form all the time, so they eat when they want, no arguments over food, no gorging, no fat Koolies.
By the time they leave for their new homes, they are eating dry pallets and chicken wings.
The ones that stay, continue this until their six months, then it's just dry pallets and the regular juicy bone around once a week if their not doing much, up to three times a week if their very active.
We've had and raised over 60 pups and not one of them has ever had a complaint on this method.
Adults can go from adult to working formula to suit their needs, and the seniors as with the pups formula is dehydrated Chicken.
They get what they need from the pallets and the meaty bones.
I honestly believe that with all the things shoved into processed pet foods we are doing more harm than good, and because you don't see the results instantly, when they do begin to show allergies or skin problems, no one associates it with the food because they have been eating it all along.
Majority of the public don't understand build up of toxins or impurities or a saturation of additives, they feed their dog with processed food because they either have faith in science or they are brainwashed by the advertising or they just plain don't think about it, apathy!
It's great to see a discussion on the most important thing to a dog, the food it consumes and the affects of that food.
Good one Lawson and thanks JJ.
Lots of new owners don't understand the reasoning behind the method of changing a dog’s diet.
That will need to be added to the pinned section for them to access more readily.

I just thought I would add my two cents as well. I have had the gambit of ages when it comes to dogs as well. Our beagle Chihuahua mix that lived to be 23 years old was on the Science Diet Senior canned formula and she did very well. We went canned because by then she had a good many of her teeth removed.

Our 15 year Sheltie was on the Science Diet W/D prescription formula and we used the joint supplement glucosamine to help the arthritis in her little elbows. She was on the dry food and the W/D is a weight management prescription food so that she did not get fat. Since she was not able to really be that active with the arthritis.

Jack is currently on the Science Diet Advantage for seniors and it has the glucosamine already added for joint lubrication. He eats two cups of dry food a day and looks wonderful. I do add about a teaspoon of Safflower oil to his food to help maintain a beautiful shiny coat. Jill is also on the Science Diet dry food, lamb and rice adult formula. And she also is thriving. She gets about a cup and an a half twice a day. They get doggie treats and my neighbor makes homemade dog cookies which Jack and Jill just love.

I don’t do the human food stuff. I have mixed feelings about it. More than anything I think my choice just stems from working for our vet for so many years and working with in the pet industry in our area. They have a strong belief that a quality dry food is what a dog needs. I have seen great results in health and management on dry food so I have not ventured into the world of table or human food for the dogs. I know that others swear by it and are successful, but I just can not see messing with something that works for me.

I am planning on using a high quality dry food for the puppies as well as a canine milk supplement to soften it as we wean them from mom. If anyone has any suggestions or ideas please feel free to let me know.

Karolina Koolies

Hi again

Just some thoughts,

My dogs get some dry food to get them from day to day but regularly get meat and bones.
I believe that natural foods are much better that artificial food.
I have a local butcher that sells lots of pork and didn't know what to do with the heads he had left untill I said I would love to have them for the dogs. this butcher now cuts them in half for us and charges us nothing for them as they are no longer a problem to him.
I don't ever seem to have problems with the dogs teeth young or old.
I think that giving dogs soft food all the time would not allow them to keep their teeth clean as I believe that this is best done chewing hard food or bones.
We also run chickens and often give the dogs an egg (Raw) when one is cracked on otherwise damaged.
I recently took a bitch of mine Sue to a long standing breeder and when this breeder saw her she asked how I keep her coat so shinny I replied eggs.

Our dogs often get raw roo meat and love it, their favourite part is the stomach contents filled with grass etc.


Jack Wilja Koolies